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08 December 2008 @ 11:32 pm
I had a big long post of emo typed up and then I deleted it because I figure, it's the holidays, and I don't want to be that person who whines and complains and vents about stupid things. I love my family, I love my friends, I'm doing well in school, I have a good life. Those are things worth focusing on.

Stephenie Meyer is a Mormon, so of course Twilight is a Very Big Deal here in Utah, or at least out here in my neck of the woods. They sell the books at the Mormon bookstores, which I find amusing and ironic. I picked up Twilight in the summer of 2007, right as the third book was about to be released. I read it on a plane ride to and from Philadelphia and pretty much devoured it. I will admit that I enjoyed it without irony. I thought it was a fun, entertaining read that kept me turning the pages. I picked up New Moon and Eclipse after that, expecting more of the same.

Well, I got roughly 180 pages into New Moon and I had to stop. I'm not a big fan of love triangles to begin with, but unnecessary love triangles drive me insane. I will admit that I'm that person, the one who never goes for the unconventional pairing or the underdog. Like, when I watched Roswell, I always wanted Max and Liz to end up together. I want Meredith and Derek to have a happy ending. Ross and Rachel are lobsters! When Buffy is done baking, I want her to be with Angel (of course, if Spike and Angel and Buffy all want to date each other simultaneously, I'm ok with that, too). The point is, I go for the obvious couple, the OTP couple, the one the writers want me to cheer for. So naturally, I wanted Edward and Bella to be together. The idea of a Jacob/Bella/Edward triangle so irrationally irritated me that I stopped reading altogether.

Well. When I saw Twilight the movie (more on that later), it renewed my interest in the universe enough for me to pick up the books and try again. And sure enough, I finished Breaking Dawn into the wee hours of Sunday night/Monday morning.

So New Moon wasn't nearly as bad as I'd made it out to be in my mind. It weirdly felt like two separate books, and admittedly I prefer it when the Cullen family is around, even though I like a lot of the characters in Jacob's world. I found myself liking Jacob, like he was sweet and funny and charming and kind of doofy and fun and I liked him as a friend for Bella. I didn't like him so much after he turned into a werewolf and I liked him even less in Eclipse when he became a total douchebag ("Bella! If you don't love me I'll kill myself!" "Bella! Let me forcibly kiss you even though you're trying to push me away and then laugh about it with your dad!"). He redeemed himself for me in Breaking Dawn, THANK GOD, I WISH HE HAD IMPRINTED ON A BABY TWO AND A HALF BOOKS EARLIER. Hearing all the "Bella's pain!" "Jacob's pain!" whining was so tiresome.

But ok, it goes back to what I said about unnecessary love triangles. Never, at any point, ever, does Stephenie Meyer make us as readers believe that Bella would choose Jacob over Edward. Throughout the entire second book Bella is grieving Edward's departure, acknowledging that she'll never love anyone like she loves him, that he's the only one for her even if he's gone. In the third book, even when she realizes she loves Jacob too, she realizes it in the same moment that she realizes it's not enough, and not nearly as much as she loves Edward. So it's like... why? What was the point of her ridiculous, over-reactive, hypocritical whining for two books over Jacob's feelings and "I love Edward more than my own life but I can't cause Jacob PAIN! What do I DO? I love Edward! But I can't bear to hurt Jacob! WOE!" and wanting to have them both just the way SHE wanted them and blah blah BLAH. I actually, in some ways, disliked the third book more than the second because the whole thing is just so unnecessary. If I believed that Bella was truly torn between the two, then yes, I could understand. But her heart is always with Edward. SO WHY? UGH, WHY?

I was actually very pleased when Jacob referred to Bella as a martyr in the fourth book, because, yes. That's exactly what she does. I went back to enjoying the series for the cracktastic reading material that it is in book four, because BYE, BYE TEDIOUS WHINING LOVE TRIANGLE BULLSHIT. I was SO vindicated when Jacob essentially told Bella the only reason he ever loved her was because he subconsciously knew she'd be the mother of his future one true love. Instead of whine whine pain, we get hilarious sex and Bella being a vampire (FINALLY) and Seth being awesome and Jacob redeeming himself from the third book and lots of interesting new vampire characters. I was expecting myself to be annoyed that there was so much build up to the fight with the Volturi and then they didn't actually fight, but I actually surprisingly enjoyed how it was all wrapped up. Like here's this big sort of dictator-like force of power, and the Cullens and their friends standing up for what they think is right, and the Volturi are shaken by it and people realizing the Volturi ISN'T all good, and Bella learning to use her shield and all that stuff. I don't know, it worked for me. Plus a happy ending, tied up in a nice, neat bow, just the way I like it, because like I said, I'm THAT person.

So you know, overall, I enjoyed the books in different ways. I'm glad I read the series. It's definitely fun and entertaining and cracktastic in places, but I don't ask much from my literary fluff, and the Twilight series delivers in just the right way. If Stephenie Meyer ever continues to write in the Twilight universe, I'd read it. Like, say, if she wanted to get over her hissy fit re: Twilight from Edward's point of view? That would be cool.

So, the movie. Right. I've seen a lot of people say they liked it, some say they didn't. I LOVED THIS MOVIE. Dude, in a sort-of-ironic-but-mostly-not-ironic at all way, I loved this movie. It took all the good elements from the first book, improved them, and left out all the stuff that wasn't as great. I feel like everyone was pretty much perfectly cast, especially Robert Pattinson as Edward. The baseball scene and the fight with James at the end were really fun to watch. I think maybe I enjoyed the movie so much because I didn't have any expectations when I went to see it, and ended up thoroughly enjoying myself. LIKE I SAID, I DON'T ASK MUCH.

So uh. How about you guys?

ETA: Other things! I really liked the endings of both New Moon and Eclipse -- the scenes with the Volturi in Italy, and Edward RIPPING OFF VICTORIA'S FOOL HEAD AND HIGH FIVING WITH SETH (if I believed in Twilight slash...) and also Edward calling Jacob "son" (that one is for the el-oh-els, not the genuine YAY!) and also everything about Alice Cullen ever. "And speaking of Italy and sports cars that I stole there, you still owe me a yellow Porsche."

ps: I'm really enjoying Folie A Deux, in a different way than I enjoyed Infinity On High, I think.
my cock won't get out of my cat.zillahseye on December 9th, 2008 07:44 am (UTC)
YES. Exactly. Dude. That is EXACTLY how I feel about the movie. I loved it. I had...really...I mean, the book was okay? But I didn't expect great things of the movie and it was EVERYTHING GREAT about the book with NONE of the shit.
Annie: confidence mancracknanny on January 8th, 2009 08:26 pm (UTC)
EXACTLY! I hope that even with a different director they can continue the trend of movie > book with New Moon. I'm hopeful! I don't think that they really CAN make a movie where Robert Pattinson is only in it at the beginning and the end, because they know he's the main draw for the films, so I do think they'll do some re-working of plot details to include him more.
Jane: Twilight: Disappointingbrightillusions on December 9th, 2008 07:52 am (UTC)
I skimmed most of this, but most of what you said I agree with. I liked the movie, I didn't love it. But I loved parts of it. The meadow minus the sparkling, was INTENSE, the baseball scene was pure win, I like the cafeteria scene so much I favorited it on youtube.com. But I laughed at the biology scene, I laughed harder at Jasper's face when Bella comes over and I almost died when he sparkled. And I was butthurt they didn't do the blood typing scene.

I still very much love the books and what Pattinson and Stewart brought to the characters. I love all things Twilight and still read the books every so often.

I'm with you, Alice is so made of win!
Annie: could he BE any cuter? (brendon)cracknanny on January 8th, 2009 08:27 pm (UTC)
Skimming rocks! And I agree with all the things you liked! I liked them too. I'm still not sold on the second and third books, mostly becuase of my issues re: love triangle as stated above, but the series is so much fun, yay!
prideandprejudiceandcheesefirewalkwithme on December 9th, 2008 08:03 am (UTC)
I've seen the movie 6 times and also loved the first book but not so much the next two. The last one was fine, but I'm not completely sold on it because some of it seemed ridiculous to me. But I still would love to see movie versions of the other books because I get the feeling they'd cut out all the annoying parts in the name of consolidation!

Plus, hehe Edward. (THAT girl lives somewhere inside me. Don't tell anyone.)
Annie: jared padalecki and his smilecracknanny on January 8th, 2009 08:29 pm (UTC)

I am in 100% agreeance with you about loving the first book, not so much the second and third, and being just kind of amused/horrified at how ridiculous book four was. I'm hoping the New Moon movie improves on the book a lot. I think they're going to have to re-work all of that "Edward is gone for most of the book" stuff because Robert Pattinson is sort of the main draw for the movies, you know?

Your secret is safe with me! We can house THAT girl together.
Itchy Witch: Twilight - Alice and Jasperbookofdays on December 9th, 2008 12:01 pm (UTC)
I think maybe I enjoyed the movie so much because I didn't have any expectations when I went to see it, and ended up thoroughly enjoying myself. LIKE I SAID, I DON'T ASK MUCH.

YES! That's what happened with me. When I read the books I was expecting them to be soooo bad that I ended up enjoying them a lot. And then I wasn't expecting much from the movie so I ended up enjoying it so much!
Annie: david's a multi-talented guycracknanny on January 8th, 2009 08:29 pm (UTC)
How can you not love sparkly vampires? At least just a little bit?
fuck you sciencemyounghistory on December 9th, 2008 02:05 pm (UTC)
I am so glad you're enjoying Twilight! I am reading the leaked chapters of Midnight Sun right now, and I'll probably read Breaking Dawn soon enough (I had resisted, just because a lot of the stuff around her pregnancy sounded way too squicky to me).

And the love triangle annoys me, too, because Jacob's my favorite character and I totally ship Jacob/Bella, and I agree--she totally needed to make a stronger case for them if she was going to spend so much time on that love triangle. Maybe the movies will correct that.

And I don't know what you're feeling emo about, but I hug you anyway. ♥
Annie: this is for ficbyzee and miss_saigoncracknanny on January 8th, 2009 08:33 pm (UTC)
Breaking Dawn is cracktastic. I don't know. I enjoyed it more than the second and third books, just because it was so INSANE. Stephenie Meyer's crazy ftw. I haven't read Midnight Sun yet, but I should probably get around to that!

I agree with you about her needing to flesh out the love triangle and do Jacob better justice. I'm with you, perhaps the next movie!

Are we back to hos over bros?lissa_bear on December 9th, 2008 08:43 pm (UTC)
Like, say, if she wanted to get over her hissy fit re: Twilight from Edward's point of view? That would be cool.

Annie: scolded for playing guitar herocracknanny on January 8th, 2009 08:34 pm (UTC)
SO MUCH WORD. Seriously, Stephenie Meyer, COME ON.
likeaspark on December 10th, 2008 01:20 am (UTC)
So yeah, I didn't read most of this because I kind of suck at the whole reading thing lately, and maybe if I could stay awake for longer stretches of time I could finish the stupid books, and damn, I knew I would never catch up with you, but anyway...

19 days!
Annie: murderous bffscracknanny on January 8th, 2009 08:34 pm (UTC)
Well you can bookmark this and come back to it once you've finished the series :-* Done with book two yet?

8 days!!! ;-)
Shatner's Cock Mitten :D: archuleta :-O WELLsnackbreak on December 10th, 2008 02:27 am (UTC)
Oh my gosh, I am so ticked, I wrote the longest comment ever and LJ ATE IT D: D: D:

but I will try again.

I had to save this to read until just now because I wasn't quite done with Breaking Dawn until about 10 minutes ago.

So I used to hate on Twilight, before the movie or even reading the actual books... well to myself at least, not on like Twilight Forums or something bitchy... and that's because I read all the mocking and the quotes about Sparkle!Time and Sweet Breath of Edward and whatever else.

But then I went to see the movie for the LULZ, which there were plenty of (omg sparkles will never not be funny), but also I KIND OF LOVED IT. because I really like romance plots and Jacob was cool and James was hot and Victoria had awesome hair and I was totally emotionally invested when Bella had to be mean to Charlie and I cringed at the leg snap.

So then I went and bought all the books and read them all and I have to say that I am way into it. Like, I agree with what you said about the gross Jacob/Edward/Bella love triangle and how it was completely pointless because she clearly was going to pick Edward forever and always and also when the Cullens aren't around I start to get bored, no matter how awesome I thought Jacob was initially.

I was really sad when he got all... shapeshiftery... because I didn't like his new attitude problem (ah they turn angsty teen so fast!) or his haircut. I had grown attached to his Flowing Tresses.

I am totally into the Cullens though, especially Alice for being so awesome and Jasper for having such an interesting history and EMMETT FOREVER. Emmett is just so cool, I mean, he loves arm wrestling, shouts about football to distract people from a tense moment, and makes suggestive comments in front of Bella's father. I LOVE HIM FOREVER.

In fact, if I had to sum up my feelings about the Twilight series in two words it would be: EMMETT FOREVER.

Also, what the eff kind of cruel parent names their kid Reneesme... and what kind of jerk boyfriend nicknames that kid NESSIE. HOLY CRAP. I really hope no one that reads your LJ has either of those names, because awkward.

Anyway, I am way into the Volturi - so so so interesting and I enjoyed trying to figure out the odds of winning against them.. and I won't be at all surprised if it does come to a battle in a future book.

Also, a friend once told me that Twilight fans were speculating on the casting of Jane and thought Dakota Fanning would be a good fit, and now everytime Jane is mentioned in the books I picture a tiny Dakota Fanning with a creepy smile on her face. EEK!
Annie: bailey (sharing my favorite activity)cracknanny on January 8th, 2009 08:41 pm (UTC)
OMG this is seriously like the best comment EVER! Hee! Ok, here goes.

For me, Twilight is something that I love in both an ironic and un-ironic way, so I totally understand what you mean by being all "WTF?" at first by everything you'd heard/read, and then getting sucked in by the movie.

I am also in complete agreeance with you about stupid love triangles and making Jacob an unnecessary jerk, as stated in my post, haha! And dude, the haircut bummed me out too. WHY CUT OFF YOUR LOVELY LADY LOCKS, JACOB?

For me the Cullen family is the best part of the series. It's interesting, I have discussions with my mom about how S.Meyer has proven with the Cullens that she can write interesting, three dimensional, fleshed out characters, yet characters like Bella and Jacob and even Charlie at times can be so faily. Also, yes: EMMETT FOREVER!

Hahaha I promise, I do not know a single soul here on LJ or in my day to day life who is named Reneesme or Nessie. Because I agree. What a jerk move.

Oh wow! Dakota Fanning as Jane would be PERFECT. I hadn't ever thought about that before, but she would do Jane utter creepy justice.
Katie: I don't dance...but I do share clothesghettogreta on December 14th, 2008 07:41 pm (UTC)
I wanted to reply to this earlier, but I read it on my phone and I just hate replying to comments on my phone cause it takes way too long and this might be a longer comment, so I thought I'd wait til I got online to do it and then I FORGOT until I just saw your newest post and you said you'd be replying to them and I was like, OH! MUST COMMENT! And wow, holy run on sentence, sorry.

I'm totally with you on enjoying the books. I think too many people who have read them after the others were released get so caught up in how many people LOVE them and don't realize that hey, they're teen books and they're NOT good. So they hate the series cause the writing's not really up to what they're expecting and they don't realize that most of the reviews are coming from 13 year old girls who think it's amazing. I loved them. Well, not exactly Breaking Dawn, but the others, I loved. I love vampires, so I'm kind of easy to please, but they were exactly what I wanted - a fun, easy, I don't have to think at all kind of read.

I remember when I was reading New Moon you were like, "I didn't like it cause Edward was gone so much" and I was kind of agreeing with you, but gah, I love Jacob. I didn't so much in New Moon, but I love him in Eclipse and I know, I know, what does that say about me, since he's kind of a dick in Eclipse, but honestly? I think Jacob's the most realistic character out of all of them. I think he's the most like a 16 year old kid. And I know, Edward's NOT 16 so he's forgiven, but I just feel like Jacob in his "of course you want me, how could you not" cockiness and his "if you just kissed me, you'll see" cockiness and then he was right. Bella found she did have some kind of feelings for him (totally unfounded cause SMeyer sucks at that shit) but he was right and I loved Jacob and Edward in the tent in Eclipse and Jacob won my heart by purposely thinking things to piss off Edward, the little shit.

And you asked why? I think it's just because SMeyer is an idiot. Also, Bella. Bella's whining and complaining is what makes her HER, and if she didn't have that, she'd be nothing. For me, the whining and Bella stressing was totally in character for her. Which is probably why I can't stand the character of Bella. I am always surprised at how much I really love the books without loving the main character.

I have a post somewhere about Breaking Dawn, it was right after the book came out if you're so inclined to check it out, but my issue with that book wasn't the other characters, it was mostly that Bella was this complete Mary Sue and yeah, she kind of was throughout the other three books, but in BD, she was AMAZING. She was the best vampire EVER, she had the best vampire power EVER, she could do anything she wanted to EVER and UGH, come the hell on! I don't care if she had years to lead up to being a vampire and she had years to convince herself she didn't want human blood, just... NO. She had like, no flaws in that book and it pissed me off. And I'm still up in the air about the ending. I can totally see your side, how it was just standing up for what they believed in and shit, but I don't know. KILL someone! Haha, I'm so used to reading Rowling, I think, that I expected someone I loved to die.

And speaking of Rowling, I feel like I should just throw this out there: I hate when people compare the two series. To me, they're totally different. I think that SMeyer geared all her books to kids (maybe cause she couldn't write any better?), but I think after book two, Rowling was almost gearing hers towards adults and older teens. I think Rowling grew as an author and her books (for me anyway) were no longer young adult/kid fiction. Maybe that has something to do with her audience getting so much older as the books came out, I mean, it was what? Seven? Eight years? If you were twelve when the first one came out, you were twenty when it was finished. So idk. But to me, they can't be compared.

Okay, this was long. Sorry!
Annie: how smart is denny duquette?cracknanny on January 8th, 2009 09:00 pm (UTC)
I told you I'd reply to this! Also I love long comments so you can leave them whenever you want :-*

You summed up everything I love about the Twilight books with "a fun, easy, I don't have to think at all kind of read" because that's EXACTLY it. People who are expecting a literary masterpiece are going to be disappointed.

You know, despite feeling like Jacob is sort of inconsistently characterized (which goes back to what you said re: SMeyer kind of sucking and fleshing things out and consistency), I agree with you about him being the most realistic character the books. Even Charlie, for me, did not really act like a father to Bella after a while and started to just get on my nerves.

Bella is probably my least favorite character in the series, so haha, I'm so with you on enjoying a book despite the fact that it's told from the POV of the character I like least. Crazy how that works out! But yeah, Bella is waaaaay too whine whine complain for her own good. Maybe SMeyer sees all teenage girls that way?

And Bella Sue is exactly why Bella is my least favorite character. I'm fairly certain Bella exists to be a self-insert Mary Sue sort of character, and that's kind of annoying in all the books, but I agree that it's most annoying in the fourth because she's OMG SO MUCH BETTER THAN ANYONE ELSE EVER. That was seriously annoying. I suppose it works if you read the books and see yourself as Bella, but not everyone is crazy deluded like SMeyer ;-) And while the ending DID work for me, I'm with you in that seeing some fighting wouldn't have been bad. It did feel a lot like an anti-climax.

UGH STOP COMPARING TWILIGHT TO HARRY POTTER. I hate that too. One of my friends was like, "Twilight is the next Harry Potter." and I said, "No it's not. They're not even close to being on the same scale. In sales alone, Breaking Dawn barely pushed 1 million copies that first weekend. Deathly Hallows was something like 13 million. And they're completely different stories with completely different audiences. You can't compare them." "Yeah, but Twilight's starting to go international. It's getting huge." Um, no. It's popular with teenage girls the way boybands were popular with teenage girls. That doesn't make it Harry Potter. Bah!

No, don't apologize! Like I said, long comments from Gretchen, yay!

Also, I love vampires too. The world needs more vampires. Write a Joe Jonas turns into a vampire fic. Or ooh, ooh! HIGH SCHOOL MUSICAL VAMPIRE AU.
(Anonymous) on December 15th, 2008 02:57 am (UTC)
Haha, so as you were posting this I had just seen Twilight and then I read the book. Just the first one, I'm waiting on the others to come in at my library. I have been studiously avoiding them forEVER because every time I flipped through them I winced. However, I figured that as I'm going to school to be a youth librarian, I should at least be up to speed on a phenomenon such as Twilight, and lucky for me one of my classmates started reading at the same time. So, we saw the movie together--and laughed, I have to say. But there were parts of it I really liked, and I think it would have been better with a bigger budget. I do agree that they left out the not so great parts of the book, and I did really like the fight scene at the end. But--again, low expectations.

And as for the book, well, once I got myself past the writing style and Bella's craziness, I liked it. Also the whole thing felt like semi-bad fan fic to me which is always really fun. Especially with the near-assault and the "gratuitous drug use" with the cold medicine.

I think my biggest drawback from the book is that Bella is so passive. She doesn't actively do much. I mean, Edward is always running around and saving her, and the end at prom--when her father called EDWARD to talk about the Tyler thing, was really off-putting to me. I prefer my girl character to kick ass, not pine and be filled with longing and need to be rescued all the time. The appeal of the book for a teenage girl is pretty obvious, but it's tough to go beyond that, and I'm not sure that was Meyer's intention, anyway. But--I'm sure I will have more to say once I read the rest of the books so I will be sure to come find you! I have not run into many people who have read them, surprisingly enough.
Leashleash on December 15th, 2008 02:58 am (UTC)
Sorry, that was me! for some reason I was logged out!
Annie: isn't it cool? i think it's coolcracknanny on January 8th, 2009 08:46 pm (UTC)

Yes! Please come find me and talk more about the books! I agree with pretty much everything that you said. Twilight IS sort of like badfic/crackfic, and that's what makes it enjoyable.

You're also spot on with Bella not being a very strong female or protagonist. She's obviously written to be a self-insert Mary Sue, so I guess she couldn't really have a strong personality of her own (other than being a pretty consistent whiner/complainer... S.Meyer's opinions on teenage girls in general?) but it's still disappointing when we're presented with females who ARE strong and independent and more fleshed out. A friend of mine couldn't continue the series because she was so put off by Bella's lack of strong will, etc.

I insisted that Jai and I see the movie when I went to visit her over New Years and she laughed too ;-) The intense vampire stares were her favorite.
Leashleash on January 25th, 2009 04:47 am (UTC)
HI! Okay so I just finished New Moon and AAHHHH Bella drove me crazy. I'm going to finish the series because it's hilarious and I want to see what the hell other crack SMeyer comes up with but seriously. I read it on an EBook reader and when the October/November/December/January stuff comes up I thought it was broken. And then I got to "Time passes...." and I was like "oh, NO." My favorite part may have been the birthday party where Edward loses his shit over Bella's paper cut and hurls her into a pile of broken dishware. Smoooooth.

I am so sad that girls read these books and are all like "I AM BELLA." Because really, she's kind of a bad person, right? Why can't they be like "I'M ALICE!!" Because Alice? Is so totally awesome. "I think she's having hysterics. Maybe you should slap her!"

I also really thought Jacob was cute. I agree that he's probably the most fleshed out character, to some extent. I love when he's like "bye, Bella. I hope you don't die." Also I TOTALLY see what you mean about this ridiculous love triange. She's only hanging out with Jacob so she can do stupid things and hear Edward yell at her (which is a whole other irritation!). I can't even believe people thought she might for one second end up with Jacob. Like, seriously! Plus, Jacob deserves better. I'm completely spoiled for the whole demon-spawn baby-imprinting situation and I still am pretty sure he deserves better.

My friend is letting me borrow the next two so I'm sure I'll have them read in short order. And then I'll come back some more!